A couple of you have asked how Cuna is doing, which is a topic never far from my mind. Last week, he was having a string of good days. He looked mostly sound, he was chipper, and I was starting to day dream about looking between his red ears again, if only for a couple of laps around the field. I can't even tall you how much I miss that. It's not that I miss riding and jumping--I can do that on Courage. It's that I miss Cuna. His attitude, his abilities, him.
Same as last time, though. As soon as I had myself convinced that maybe I could hop on for a wee bareback ride, the weather changed, he dropped weight, and he went dead lame. Again. This time it was so bad that our fellow boarder called to let me know.
I appreciated the gesture, but I'd already seen him. I added in more fat to his feed and gave him a thorough grooming. He likes coming in to the barn and hanging out with me, but he wasn't moving well.
I'm at a loss for what to do. The standard protocol for laminitic horses is dry lots, grass hay, low starch feed and all the things he had at his last barn. That didn't help. On top of being dead lame, he hated it there. He hated turnout and was cranky most of the time. Now he's at a happy place as far as his brain goes, but it eats me up to watch him hobble around.For now, I'm letting him be. Our farrier, who seems to be the only one not completely befuddled, has said that it will take up to a year for him to recover, maybe more. He said to give Cuna time to come around.
We have time.
My next step is going to be exploring to see what's out there to help him toughen up his feet, since he's going barefoot for now. Any suggestions?
His lameness is being caused by laminitis? Sorry, I'm new to your blog and had looked through your past posts on Cuna's lameness trying to see if you had ever mentioned what was causing it, and couldn't find it. I know you've tried a million things with him, but have you tried the Kellon protocol with him? It is specifically for Cushing's/insulin resistant horses who have foundered and/or have chronic laminitis.
ReplyDeleteHere is more info on Dr. Kellon: http://ecirhorse.org/
And here is her Yahoo group, which she manages: http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/EquineCushings/info
Her system was a lifesaver for an insulin resistant QH that I owned.
For toughening feet, farriers and trimmers have recommended Durasole and Keratex. I use Durasole due to the much lower price tag and have had great success with it, but a lot of barefoot people swear by Keratex Hoof Hardener and the Gel.
Fascinating. I'm going to spend some time reading through that.
DeleteHe had a laminitic episode on the heels of a tying up episode and both were completely out of character for him. I suspect metabolic changes due to aging prompted both.
:-( I'm sorry that Cuna isn't feeling better. But I have to say, he is as beautiful as ever! <3
ReplyDeletePoor Cuna and poor you! I'm sorry he's still struggling. No advice here, just hugs!
ReplyDeleteKeratex has really helped harden up Fiction's feet - they don't tear/chip as much when he pulls shoes now. I also really like the DuMOR hoof supplement. It has loads more Biotin in it per serving than Smartpak and Platinum.
ReplyDeleteTuff stuff. Put it on very other day.
ReplyDeleteKeratex Hoof Hardener really works. And, if you do a hoof supplement, keep in mind that a horse only needs between 15 and 25mg of Biotin to improve horn growth, anymore more than that is redundant and not worth your money.
ReplyDeleteMy horse is just recovering from acute mechanical laminitis. He is a little more than 4 weeks out from the diagnosis and is relatively stable. We suspect it was brought on by over-trimming by a well meaning farrier, that simply didnt realize my boy's feet were collapsing from a simple lack of weight bearing of surface area.
ReplyDeleteHe did not rotate, but has reduced sole depth and evidence of laminae detachment on both feet. I was lucky in that I caught it, we were headed down the road to true founder.
Though his case may be slightly different than yours. Do you know what the initial cause is? Have you run an endo panel to rule out metabolic issues? esp with his sudden weight loss, his thyroid could be wonky and causing his feet to be inflamed. I assume you have x-rays confirming damage, or at a minimum inflammation?
We tried a few things including funky expensive shoes, but what made it settle was diet changes (pulled all grain and put him on coarse first-cutting hay soaked for a minimum of 30 minutes in hot water), pretty strong doses of anti-inflammatories (Equioxx), vasodilators to promote blood flow (isoproxine), pulling the shoes and putting him in a pair of therapeutic boots called Soft Ride boots. They have frog support and allow the horse to balance the bulk of the weight on their frogs and provide the sole some relief, which in turn will help the inflammation to settle. Once he was in the soft ride boots, it took about 10 days for his feet to return to normal temperatures and for him to be comfortable bearing weight without shifting constantly.
What your farrier is telling you as far as time is in line with what my vet/farrier team is telling me, basically that my horse needs to grow a new foot and could be off for up to a year. One thing that concerns me about Cuna - If he is sooo painful that means he is acute, which means the laminae in his feet are more than likely inflamed. Also, if he is going from comfy to painful, comfy to painful, something may be setting him off whether it be a mechanical or metabolic insult. From what I understand. if the laminae are inflamed they are weakened and he is more at risk to further damage to the inner structures of his feet, ie rotation/sinking.
My horse was pretty lame at the walk,but was willing to move. He never had a digital pulse and was negative to hoof testers. He was not able to stand comfortably on either front foot for longer than 30 seconds at a time. His feet were HOT averaging 97-100 degrees F, normal is 86. Now that he is "sub-acute" his feet are back to high 80s low 90s and he is able to stand comfortably. We introduced him back to unsoaked hay and started adding a low starch high protein grain this week. It was a long road and the first week i was at the barn every 2 hours icing his feet to try and reduce the temps while we figured out what would make his feet happy.
I dont know what you have done up to now and what your vet is telling you, but you may want to do some research on laminitis symptoms, grades and treatments. There are tons of ways to treat it and no particular protocol is 100% correct, but the goal is to reduce the inflammation and get the horse to a point where it is at least comfy, willing to move, and able to recover.
We are past the acute phase--he is walking again and looks like he wants to be alive. He had a bounding digital pulse at the time, but it has settled down. The xrays indicated lots of soft tissue inflammation, but showed no rotation.
DeleteWe went the funky shoes route first. We got him to the point that he was pretty sound walk/trot in hand, but he just needed time. Lots of time. He's been turned out since July. So far, the on/offness has correlated with the wet/dry cycles (mostly). He was completely off grain until the temperatures dropped (which correlated with his weight loss). He's back on a low starch senior with rice bran to help with his weight, but I'm steering clear of supplements for the most part.
I think the next step is going to be checking for metabolic changes with bloodwork.
Good luck! I feel your pain, totally! I hope that you are successful in finding a resolution. At least his spirits are up, that tells you that you are doing right by him in continuing to fight it.
DeleteI didnt think to ask, what are you using for pain management? Equioxx has worked wonderfully for my guy, we initially treated with bute and switched him over. We are down to 1/4 tube per day, and will most likely switch to 1/2 tab previcox daily for long term support. Also, I second the comment below re: therapeutic gel soled boots. I swear my gelding sighed with relief when we put his soft ride boots on for the first time, even on top of 6 inches of shavings. They are quite snug so are suitable for limited T/O.
Sorry for the novel, your original post just hit close to my heart. :o( Hang in there.
I'm sure you are doing everything you can since you love him and if you have time and he's safe, then give him time.
ReplyDeleteIs it really laminitis? I too don't remember reading that before. Is he on something like Previcox when he's ouchy?
ReplyDeleteKeratex hoof hardener really keeps Phoenix sound, Durasole has more specific application rules that I just couldn't deal with. I haven't used Tuff Stuff in years, but it always seemed like nail polish before, lol.
Not sure if you've read that far back in my blog, but P was off and on lame with shoes on, with and without wedges/pads. I finally pulled his shoes (against farrier's wishes) last year (a year ago at the end of this past August) and started putting keratex on his feet and he is so much happier. A little ouchy on really hard ground or if he hits a random piece of gravel, but at 24 and after a battle with white line disease when I got him back I will take it!
Sometimes you just keep trying things until something works, hopefully something someone says here will help your boy. I also read tons of books and forums all while consulting with my vet. As she told me, worst case it doesn't work and you change it. And always follow your gut! You know the horse better than anyone else.
I dealt with a similar situation with my retired jumper. It took a year of turnout and he walks sound and is comfortable. For his feet I use kopertox daily and Venice turpentine. Works wonders!
ReplyDeleteI think it is great that you are giving Cuna the time and happiness he needs to recover. So many people just give up. It is evident that you love him, not only as a riding partner, but as a four legged friend.
ReplyDeleteAs for hooves, a horse at my barn made a transition to barefoot and did really well with Keratex and a hoof supplement (SmartHoof from SmartPak). You might also try SmartSox which is a supplement to increase blood flow and healing to the lower legs/hooves and has had good results with laminitic horses.
The waiting game is tough, I'm sorry to hear he's still ouchy. We had good luck with good ol' venice turpentine painted on the soles. Looks like you got A LOT of good advice and insights from these other commenters though! <3 Cunafish!
ReplyDeleteOh Cuna, how I wish I could heal him for you. You might give Previcox a try, it was originally created for dogs with arthritic or inflammatory conditions, and it has been found very successful for horses too. Also safer than bute or banamine. And the good news is, a horse only needs 1/4 tablet of the 227mg size. To give you a comparison, Meaty would need two of those tablets for his dose. Just drop it in his grain and he should eat it right up! With doing this though, you won't be able to tell if he is actually having a good day or a bad day. But, if you don't want to see him gimping around, it is an option.
ReplyDeleteSo, I've never commented before, but I've been a loyal reader about Cuna as I have an...interesting redheaded gleding as well.
ReplyDeleteJust wanted to second [third, fourth?] the Keratex suggestion. And to wish you well!
There is lots of goop out there and I tried about all of them on Solo. The only things that work are Durasole for the bottoms (MAGIC, but don't put it on the frogs) and Keratex hardener for the outer wall. The guy who invented Durasole posts in the Horse Care forum on COTH so you can chat with him too, he's friendly and helpful. Encore is getting beleagured with it right now and BF's horse gets it too. Awesome stuff. I totally get what you mean about missing the red ears, sigh.
ReplyDeleteI'd love to go out for a good Solo gallop!! He'd probably have a heart attack from being out of shape though. But with feet, I agree with your farrier, it can take a loooooooooooooooooong time. Would you believe it has taken TWO YEARS for Solo's feet to get back from where our previous crappy farrier ruined them? It has finally happened, but wow, I would never have believed it if someone told me that. Patience is hard, but if he's bright and happy, a bit of hobbling in the grass is livable. BF's thin-soled mare is doing that right now and she is still sassy and content with her very easy life!
You're doing the right thing by having him in a situation that makes him happy. And giving him delicious numnums <3
ReplyDeleteanother vote for the Keratex line of hoof products. I have used both the hardener and the gel (gel for the sole) and really like the results I got. My horse's feet also improved dramtically when I started her on biotin (I just buy the human 10 mg tabs and give her three a day, its cheaper than horse version) and used in conjuntion with her normal multivite and TriAmino. I also completely got her off of prepared feeds and just started doing alfalfa cubes/beet pulp/rice bran, to see if she had a soy allergy (mostly to see if it would improve her temperment) but I've read that it can really help their feet to get them off soy.
ReplyDeletePoor Cuna. I think that it sounds like you're doing right by him. If he didn't enjoy his last situation, then that is simply another issue you don't have to deal with. A lot can be said for having a happy horse. I think that should be an important factor.
ReplyDeleteNo advice, I spent over 12 years with a very laminitic horse that didn't end well. Hoping Cuna shines through this tough spot.
ReplyDeleteI've heard great things about turpintine for hardening feet!
ReplyDeleteHugs and heres to Cuna feeling better asap!
Forgive me if you've already tried this (I can't remember) but I would get a pair of easycare rehab boots with nice thick pads and put them on him when he's sore. Thick pads = comfort = more movement = better hoof growth
ReplyDeleteDiscomfort is the enemy of a barefoot horse.
I can't tell you anything more than what other people have already mentioned but I'm sure you'll get there. It always seems in these cases where we go up 1 step to fall back 3. Patience will pay off.
ReplyDeleteOh Cuna...I'm so sorry. Ugh. Everything I would say has been said, so I just say "HUGS!" Hugs to you and Cuna.
ReplyDeleteSorry to hear about Cuna. Time is the best healer as they say but in some ways it is also the hardest to handle because you have to wait for it. Hope he gets to feeling better sooner rather than later.
ReplyDeleteLots of good advice, from getting bloodwork done to check for IR to keeping the sugars in his feed low to trying boots with pads. I hope Cuna feels better soon!
ReplyDeletePoor Cuna. It hurts so much to see our animals in pain when you don't feel like you can do anything to help. *Hugs*
ReplyDeleteSorry to hear hes still struggling with the lameness. I agree with the above comment. It is hard to see our horses (animals) in pain when there is really nothing obvious we can do to take it away. At least he is happy though. :)
ReplyDelete